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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:15 am  (#11) 
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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:18 pm  (#12) 
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Hmmm… the 2GB size limit really looks like one of these filesystem limits, especially with older Windows OS. But as you say it's Windows 10, 64-bit on NTFS, that would be a weird limit (I don't think they have such silly limits anymore).
Anyway if you can upload one of your XCF somewhere, a good idea could be to open a bug report and give a link: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=GIMP
This way, we can try and check the file. Maybe there is an actual file corruption during saving time. If so, that would be worth checking. Even better, if you have any reproduction steps which always result in a corrupted file on your system, we could check if they also work on ours.

As for GIMP not being suited for big animations, it's mostly true (for now) because there is no efficient way to store an animation in a XCF file, and no efficient GUI to handle the logics behind. This will change soon. That's the kind of things we do: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=15138

The idea behind 1 layer == 1 frame is just terrible as soon as you want to do serious animation (more than a few seconds). Well on the other hand, you say you do mostly abstract animations. So maybe in your case, you don't have any choice (well… not sure what an "abstract" animation entails exactly, but I could imagine that it means there is not much levels in the animation, so you can't really use the power of layers; just guessing).

Also as other noted, you should definitely break your artwork into smaller pieces (usually you would cut it in "sequences", that's what we do). Note that that's what all film-makers will do. You don't edit a single movie into 1 single file (you could imagine it would be terrabytes in the end of a feature-length movie!). So you need to break it into smaller chunks that you can actually process. Then later you edit and "link" your sequences together. An animation artwork is often incremental this way.

For info on any of our projects, we never had XCF files that big as yours. So I would guess that's probably what you have to work on to improve your workflow. :-)


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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:24 am  (#13) 
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Appreciate the input, thanks Jehan!

Well I've definitely got the message about breaking my work up into smaller parts first, I'm doing that now and that does help, at least my work is intact..

I'm attempting to upload an xcf (one of the corrupted ones) to my Google Drive, my internet connection is not the fastest by any means and as the file is just over 2GB this could take some time (currently it's telling me it will take 4hrs 45mins!), after that I will link it on the bug report site you mentioned. As for the reproduction steps.. what I do is simply make some artwork, then add to it or modify it in some way at each step (layer) often employing plug-ins and scripts to enhance things of course.. sometimes completely changing views from one frame to the next .. all of this is usually problem -free, but like I've said before, once I reach that 2GB mark, things seem to become problematic and the newer saves can be corrupted, missing frames, disordered in some way.. hopefully by my keeeping them smaller in size that won't happen again.

Thanks for the animation tips, I'm not in any way, shape or form a serious artist, more of a doodler lol.. the stuff I produce (which I refer to as 'abstract animation', although I'm not sure that's a precise definition..) is usually just a lot of colourful patterns and weird effects put together with no real vision as such, I often complete a work, then use GAP to animate it, after which I make some adjustments and then put music or other sound to it.. here's an example of one of my latest efforts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edCZ-ZpUgnE (best viewed in 720p)

So, I'm not sure how else to achieve the results I want with animating without simply adding layer upon layer, to me this is similar to one frame following another frame and so on.. but maybe I'm wrong on this (I DO understand the concept of individual layers in general and how they work in relation to single images, and in fact some of the layers that I use as frames are themselves flattened images from multiple layers) - how would you approach it differently using GIMP as a base?

I'll update when the xcf file is uploaded... that reminds me, I'd better create an account on the GNOME bugzilla. site :)

MANY THANKS!!


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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 2:33 pm  (#14) 
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Which category should I put the bug report in btw? The choices are: Data / General / Gimp-Python / Jenkins / libgimp / User Interface / Windows Installer (I left a few out that are not relevant)

If anyone is interested the following link is to one of my .xcf files that is large (2GB - although only about 750 layers) and got corrupted somehow: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1KF4x ... sp=sharing

Cheers.


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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:02 pm  (#15) 
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I can not immediately reproduce the saving xcf error. Using one of ofnuts clever plug-ins, duplicated existing layers to create a larger file - 994 layers. That saves (2.8 GB) and opens ok here - linux laptop 8 GB memory

Attachment:
largexcf.jpg
largexcf.jpg [ 198.7 KiB | Viewed 192 times ]

That little linux utility xcfinfo lists the layers in a file and reports what is expected,
original file: Version 0, 1218x914 RGB color, 751 layers, compressed RLE
larger file: Version 0, 1218x914 RGB color, 994 layers, compressed RLE
so no 'missing' layers reported.

For video:
You do need a uniform frame (canvas) size and frame rate (fps) for easily joining parts into a complete file.
Not entirely true of your file which has some small layers. The timing though, is uniform throughout 100ms = 1/10th second. So you then have a choice, use a video frame rate of 10 fps and 1 layer per frame, or say 20 fps and double up each frame. That is what that little batch file does, uses ffmpeg to generate 2 or 3 video frames for each image layer.

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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:59 am  (#16) 
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rich2005 wrote:
Using one of ofnuts clever plug-ins,


I read that as meaning that some aren't :)

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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 4:06 am  (#17) 
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ofnuts wrote:
rich2005 wrote:
Using one of ofnuts clever plug-ins,


I read that as meaning that some aren't :)


Indeed not ;)

Means another one of the total clever plugins available at

http://sourceforge.net/projects/gimp-to ... s/scripts/

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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 5:07 am  (#18) 
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Interesting.. thanks again for the input.. why would some layers be duplicated though? Or did I do that originally.. don't quite get it.
Anyway, this is the error I was shown when I opened the file before uploading it onto my Drive:

Image

SO, it was missing some content, not sure how much now but could have been as much as 20% of the original if I remember correctly.

Also, with this file there is a lot of strange pixelation going on that was definitely not there to start with..

Oh yeah, the batch program works fine thanks, but the anitools thing, I'm not sure how to get that to work in GIMP, obviously you gave me a link to anitools.py.txt and told me to remove the .txt part, do I have to use the Python_Fu part of GIMP for that (which I've never used before.. no idea how to.. not being a programmer or anything !) or is there something I'm missing (probably!)

I'll be looking into Ofnuts' Gimp Tools - cheers.


Last edited by Zero01 on Sun Jan 15, 2017 6:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 6:07 am  (#19) 
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Oh btw.. as you can see - when the file was opened the filename doesn't appear it just says 'Untitled' at the top - this happens every time an xcf file goes bonkers.


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 Post subject: Re: Just one problem with animations..
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 6:31 am  (#20) 
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Zero01 wrote:
Oh btw.. as you can see - when the file was opened the filename doesn't appear it just says 'Untitled' at the top - this happens every time an xcf file goes bonkers.


Must be some kind of protection. There are several reasons for a file to be corrupted on load, and some of them do not mean that the initial file is damaged (network error if it is on a remote system for instance). So this would prevent you to overwrite the "good" file with the partially loaded copy.

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