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 Post subject: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:36 am  (#1) 
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I have installed 2.7.0 for windows.
2.6.11 does no longer support my Wacom CTE 640 tablet , 2.7. 0 does support my Wacom tablet (including pressure sensitivity). So I switch between two versions of Gimp as some stuff does not work in 2.7.0 (Text does not seem to work in 2.7.0)
Being a windows user like most people, I am learning Ps as I do not think that Gimp developers will do anything about Windows and Wacom tablets. For some reason this has always been a problem in Gimp and I am getting sick of having to make convoluted work arounds to make Wacom tablet work in Gimp . My tablet always works in every other application.
Jernej Simoncic Thank you for your Windows downloads. It seems you are the only one responsible for windows downloads.
I do have Ubuntu but I really want to run Gimp in windows and I simply do not like Linux.
I think that unless Gimp attracts more Windows developers it will die a slow death just as Open Office is doing. I no longer use Oo because it takes so long before you actually get to put pen to paper .

Please don't tell me to help develop Gimp. I am not a programmer. I am a user like most people who have a computer . I wish I was a programmer. If Gimp aspires to be a real alternate means to Ps (not necessarily as a PS substitute) it must work and currently Gimp and tablets dont mix (yet again) .

Most people that are serious about graphics use a tablet and whether the problem is Cairo , GtK or whatever it should work at every release. It seems that I never have the required dll's to make it run and every time I need to re-install Mathmap I run into trouble (thank you PhotoComix for your contributions here).

Just my little rave. Lately, I am so disappointed in Gimp.

I am still very much a Gimp user and enjoy this forum very much.

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:31 am  (#2) 
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The fact remains that GIMP is a Linux application. I've used Linux-GIMP with a tablet for many years without a problem. Windows support is a nice bonus feature, but that's basically it. It would of course be nice if more Windows users were interested/had the skill to contribute to development of the Windows port, but the Windows world, big as it is, is traditionally more one of end users and less of tinkerers and coders. That said, end users are legion. It would be sad to see GIMP loosing users due to shaky Windows support.

As a side note, it's fascinating how different views one can have of operating systems. It would never occur to me to do any sort of serious work under Windows. It would be like tying my hands behind my back. Obviously many don't share my view, but Windows is a toy OS as far as I'm concerned. The professional scientists I know that run Windows actually run Linux on it in a virtual machine. Maybe that's an option for GIMP too?
.
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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:34 am  (#3) 
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Yes i am seriously considering a side by side install on my machine.Just so i can use a tablet without problems.
I feel for you wbool63, but Griatch is correct.Gimp is and always will be a Linux program.
I have always been a windows user for the simplicity of install (i am lazy).
But lately i have been getting into the aspect of compiling well trying to compile on windows.Which is virtually impossible with the way windows sees paths and variables. (sometimes it sees them sometimes it don't sorta like a mounds candy bar.)
Anyways yeah that's my plan i already have the disc, just wondering which machine to set it up in.
Probably going to just buy a new one and install Linux into it fully.Then i'm off to buy a tablet i think.

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:46 am  (#4) 
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I used Gimp many years under Windows. But my experience was that there were many problems under Windows. I have used Linux for about a year now, and I have not had a problem with Gimp in this OS. I teach beginners how to use computers and during that training many want to use Gimp. Unfortunately most use Windows and we are constantly running into problems with the installation and/or use of the program. My clients ask my many times "Why can't my Gimp do what yours does?" To which I must then explain the different OS. And several have changed OS.

I actually gave up Windows because I couldn't get any serious work done on it what with all the shutdowns, freezes, reboots. I spent more time setting up to start work than I did actually working. I find Linux to be more stable, more reliable, and once you understand how the system functions, much more easier to use overall. And regardless of what people say, it is not too difficult to learn. Come to think of it, the Linux operating system is itself easier to use than some programs.

I have seen many things done in PS and I am not impressed really, having used Gimp for almost ten years now. Everything that I have seen done in PS and liked I can replicate in Gimp. And as long as there is graphic design, Gimp will survive. Activity in Gimp, with the program, with the support of it, seems to have increased tremendously as of late. There are brilliant people supporting the program, many of whom you will find here in this forum.

Give Linux another chance. I mean there really isn't anything not to like, imho. You just have to realize that Linux is different from Windows. Looks different and acts different. But it is very professional, very efficient, and a very viable alternative/upgrade to Windows.

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:52 am  (#5) 
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Rod wrote:
I have always been a windows user for the simplicity of install (i am lazy).

Not to turn this into an OS vs OS discussion, but the impression that Linux is difficult to install things on is really mostly a myth today. It used to be a hassle when I first started, but these days I find installation of 99% of all programs to be considerably easier in Linux (Debian) than on Windows. The only higher entrance level lies in the use of the command line. "apt-get install <program name>", and then the system goes online and fetches everything (including libraries, drivers needed to run etc) for you. Just wait for it to finish, then start the new program - that's it. The remaining 1% you need to compile yourself, which can be a little more work (although in Linux it usually boils down to two commands: "make" and "make install"). And compiling in Windows is no cakewalk either anyhow.
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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:01 pm  (#6) 
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I pretty much use GIMP in Windows solely (use it in Linux too for a few plugins that have no Windows compiles; very rarely of course). I agree that GIMP Windows, especially since I upgraded to Win7, can crash more often then you would like, but it works for me for the most part. I too have been using GIMP for around 10 years (well, it will be 10 years in a few months; lol). I also have Photoshop (CS5) and do agree that I like GIMP better except for one thing; RAW file manipulation. UFRaw just doesn't cut it for me. I like ACR much better. I keep PS around just for that purpose and occasionally for a few cool actions like Panos's Stamp action (one of my favorites). With Python, GIMP can use other stand-a-lone programs (thanks to RobA) that really puts GIMP on steroids. XNView does a 1000% better job at executing PS filters then PSPI for instance and it even does so in Linux. If you need Impressionist (XNView does not run Impressionist unfortunately), Irfanview runs Impressionist and I use to use Irfanview as a copy paste surrogate to run it before RobA showed me how to get Impressionist to run via PSPI (one of the few PS filters that actual work quite well in GIMP via PSPI and it happens to be one of my favorites). Still, if PSPI has issues with GIMP Linux, you can use Irfanview (via Wine) to run Impressionist filter. I've actually tried this with my Linux VM and it works. Now, if you use Rob's Python interface, you can have GIMP directly call Irfanview to run the filter and the copy it's contents back into GIMP without copy/paste. I've not set up Linux GIMP with Rob's Python plugin. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:21 pm  (#7) 
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Funny. I have been professional software developer more than twenty years. I have long background in Unix AND Windoozy world, so I've seen both sides pretty well. I've always thought Unix (which Linux basically is) as professional development platform and Windows as a home user environment, until last year. Last year something changed, finally.

My PC's motherboard practically melted. So, because I'm computer addict hobbyist and need the main machine to maintain family network, I hurried to local drug hardware dealer and bought parts. I thought that I'd buy Windows 7 later, because I didn't have enough cash. That was very lucky!

So, I built the new PC, got it working and just to test the rig, I installed Ubuntu Linux (took almost half an hour, not bad). I still thought to change it to Windows 7... Or to at least dual boot... But then, I got everything working and everything worked really well. Scanner, printer, Wacom tablet, several digital cameras, USB hard disks, DVB-T stick, sound system, mobile phone, iPod, all little gadgets... All worked like charm.

But real surprise was applications. Linux has very fine and diverse environment for many things. Graphics applications like Gimp, Inkscape, Blender, Mypaint and Krita cover very large need. But I had pro level graphics Windoozy apps, some of those were important to me. But then I investigated Wine. Via Wine I got many apps working under Linux. For example, ZBrush 4 works as well as in Windows. Also, thingies like 3D-Coat and AC3D have native Linux versions now. And looks like Linux market is growing and growing.

So here I am. I have almost everything I can wish for in Linux, I have rock solid platform for playing and developing new playthings. I'm not even considering Windoozy any more.

And I feel very good about that!


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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:29 pm  (#8) 
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wbool63 wrote:
I have installed 2.7.0 for windows.
2.6.11 does no longer support my Wacom CTE 640 tablet , 2.7. 0 does support my Wacom tablet (including pressure sensitivity). So I switch between two versions of Gimp as some stuff does not work in 2.7.0 (Text does not seem to work in 2.7.0)
Being a windows user like most people, I am learning Ps as I do not think that Gimp developers will do anything about Windows and Wacom tablets. For some reason this has always been a problem in Gimp and I am getting sick of having to make convoluted work arounds to make Wacom tablet work in Gimp . My tablet always works in every other application.
Jernej Simoncic Thank you for your Windows downloads. It seems you are the only one responsible for windows downloads.
I do have Ubuntu but I really want to run Gimp in windows and I simply do not like Linux.
I think that unless Gimp attracts more Windows developers it will die a slow death just as Open Office is doing. I no longer use Oo because it takes so long before you actually get to put pen to paper .

Please don't tell me to help develop Gimp. I am not a programmer. I am a user like most people who have a computer . I wish I was a programmer. If Gimp aspires to be a real alternate means to Ps (not necessarily as a PS substitute) it must work and currently Gimp and tablets dont mix (yet again) .

Most people that are serious about graphics use a tablet and whether the problem is Cairo , GtK or whatever it should work at every release. It seems that I never have the required dll's to make it run and every time I need to re-install Mathmap I run into trouble (thank you PhotoComix for your contributions here).

Just my little rave. Lately, I am so disappointed in Gimp.

I am still very much a Gimp user and enjoy this forum very much.


Funny you say that... I follow the Gimp developers mailing list and some of the money donated to the Gimp foundation has been used to purchase a new Wacom tablet to make sure Gimp supports the new features. 2.7/2.8 has a greatly changed control of brush dynamics.

Gimp work with my Wacom Bamboo tablet on WinXP and Linux.

Not being a developer isn't an excuse for not filing a bug report (bugzilla.gnome.org, from memory) :)

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:36 pm  (#9) 
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Griatch wrote:
Rod wrote:
I have always been a windows user for the simplicity of install (i am lazy).

Not to turn this into an OS vs OS discussion, but the impression that Linux is difficult to install things on is really mostly a myth today. It used to be a hassle when I first started, but these days I find installation of 99% of all programs to be considerably easier in Linux (Debian) than on Windows. The only higher entrance level lies in the use of the command line. "apt-get install <program name>", and then the system goes online and fetches everything (including libraries, drivers needed to run etc) for you. Just wait for it to finish, then start the new program - that's it.
On modern distros you have a graphic application for that... what makes Linux software installation much easier is that 98% of the packages you run come from a single repository. No need to roam the Internet looking for a download... And since all the packages handle cross-dependencies in a system-wide manner, new packages are fairly small, there is very little duplication of function in the code.

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:43 pm  (#10) 
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That's basically what i use windows for here in my family room computer.
Quick access to bank accounts and billing sites.I do all my bill paying online via my bank.
Well all except my credit cards.I pay those directly at their respective sites.I am so used to doing all that through my windows machine i hate to screw it up (because i would :lol
But i am going to go grab another machine with at minimum 2gigs ram.
I can not wait to see how Gimp and Inkscape perform under their real platforms.

Quote:
On modern distros you have a graphic application for that... what makes Linux software installation much easier is that 98% of the packages you run come from a single repository. No need to roam the Internet looking for a download... And since all the packages handle cross-dependencies in a system-wide manner, new packages are fairly small, there is very little duplication of function in the code.


Yeah i understand that ofnuts, basically you download everything but the kitchen sink for each program as all the needed libraries and other files are already installed and work for them all.Simple but very effective way of doing things.

Windows should be drooling over linux, actually they probably do. :lol

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:41 pm  (#11) 
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wbool63 wrote:
I have installed 2.7.0 for windows.
2.6.11 does no longer support my Wacom CTE 640 tablet , 2.7. 0 does support my Wacom tablet (including pressure sensitivity). So I switch between two versions of Gimp as some stuff does not work in 2.7.0 (Text does not seem to work in 2.7.0)


I am running Gimp 2.6.11 on an older Windoze XP machine, with my Wacom CTH-460 and it works from me. When I did have problems with it, originally, I went to Wacom's site and downloaded the driver update. I've gotten it to work for me. When I had my Win 7 machine, it worked there too. I hope within the next few days my replacement machine will be ready. My advice would be to see about new Wacom drivers.

Greg

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 Post subject: Re: Where is Gimp going?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:21 pm  (#12) 
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Hi, Guys, Yes I know that Gimp is a Linux/Unix based application and I definitely do not want to turn this into a win vs. ‘nix discussion. We have had plenty of those on other forums.
I am merely expressing my disappointment that a program (Gimp) I like just doesn’t seem to cut it on Windows any more due to tablet support. For the last three years it worked fine under XP (including tablet support) and Gimp was becoming a genuine alternative to expensive proprietary programs for many people who run windows.
Many IT articles extolled the virtues of Gimp as a good solid program for photo manipulation as a free program for windows, which with the advent of digital cameras has become a huge market.
With the drift to Win 7 and x64, Gimp will lose a huge fan base if tablet support for windows is not implemented.
I, for one, have recommended Gimp to a lot of people as a great program and found good acceptance with people who want more than Ps Elements or other basic photo manipulation programs but I no longer can do so .
Since I have upgraded to Win 7 I have not re-installed Ubuntu yet, but I will again and run with a dual boot machine as I have for a few years.

I am not “bagging” Unix/Linux. I have used Ubuntu on and off for a couple of years, but I prefer windows as an OS. It is as simple as that.

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